A Day Late and a Dollar Short
Meeting at Town Hall - 19-June-2004 13:00 (1:00 PM)
Come and meet a real live anarchist, Amanda Philips. She does not want to take over, she wants anarchy. Amanda Philips is the President and National Spokesperson of the Free State Project.
I heard yesterday Jason P Sorens exposed freetown Jay's criminal past. Freetown Jay had just resigned his Free State Project membership. Today some FSP members have been calling for Zack's head on a stick. Zack is no longer listed as the #1 poster of the FSP forum. "Something bad" seems to have happend to his FSP account.
Amanda Philips, if you are going to claim FSP and FTP are not connected in any way, I suggest you do not come to the meeting tomorrow. You would be either lying, or you do not know the truth. The clearest connection between FSP and FTP would be Tim Condon. Hopefully Tim Condon and Jason P. Sorens would not put you up to this alone. Will they be attending?
25 Comments:
Here's a fun link to try:
http://www.dc.state.fl.us/AppCommon/searchall.asp?Action=Find
Type Denonville -- aka Jay Freestatecampground -- into the last name box. What comes up is positively scary!
5:42 PM
Did anyone notice how the only one to mention Jay was Amanda Philips? She just happend to throw Jay's first and last name out while bashing Zack.
11:29 PM
I'm not a resident of Grafton, but I am a lifelong (albeit only 19 years so far) resident of New Hampshire, and I can't think of any place better to live. I wanted to extend my sincere wishes that you are successful in defeating the proposed relocation of these alleged "free-towners" to New Hampshire. Here, further south in the state, we've got far too many folks from outside moving and wanting to change things... most of them here are from Mass of course and can't be bothered with driving an extra 10 minutes to a Target, they need one in town. It's time we stand up and tell folks that if they are going to move here, they have to accept the way of life and more importantly the well-being and the way of life of the current ihabitants. I hope your town remains free; certainly it will not be with outsiders moving in and proposing radical changes.
Regards,
Mike Bellefeuille
Bedford, NH
12:47 AM
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Anonymous said...
I hope your town remains free; certainly it will not be with outsiders moving in and proposing radical changes.
Regards,
Mike Bellefeuille
Bedford, NH
---------------
The people running this website and the ad hominem attacks against libertarians do not want to keep Grafton free. They are Democrats and Socialists that want to steal people's property, businesses and children and give it all to the State just like any dirty marxist communist would. They haven't been able to do it because they are the minority in Grafton (a measly 150 or so - the only people that showed up saturday to the non-official town meeting) so they are using the ever-present "libertarian" black sheep to smear an entire movement with negative political advertising.
- Mark
6:08 AM
Who runs the savegrafton site?
8:01 AM
Residents of Grafton run the save grafton site. I am one of them. My name was in the first Concord Monitor story..I had the doom and gloom quote. My name is Rebecca Richard. Now What? You want to sue me? Never do business with me? Do a background check? Harass my family? I have posted on this site as Rebecca explaining why we put this site up. I never understood why my name mattered. I never started a group of migratory people to move to NH to sweetly convince all NH residents that we could make it better.We put this site up for our residents of Grafton and NH. It is obvious that FTP wanted to keep their plan on the down low. They wanted to sneak in quietly. Now they have to come in with everyone fully aware of their plans. Is that illegal? FYI I have never posted on the FSP site. I wouldn't. What is the point? I can't convince FSP/FTP people that they shouldn't take over NH/Grafton. They have already put lots of money in to the move to Grafton and/or NH.All I wanted to do was inform the town and see if that is what they want. Maybe they do want to be taken over by you guys,especially since you plan to take us over in a neighborly way.
8:28 AM
Hey Mark- you WISH what you say is true.
8:30 AM
Hey Mark- you WISH what you say is true.
8:30 AM
Don't bet on it.
1:40 PM
Michael the leopard is an FTP guy with all of the answers! Why wasn't he at the meeting? He is all over FSP letting all of FSP and FTP know that Grafton residents just don't understand. He says that Hull is harassed in NJ about the colors he is or is not allowed to paint his house. That is common in NJ. I know people in NJ that have to put up with those rules and more. They don't mind because they like their friends and town and they accept the rules.Hull should have moved out of NJ as soon as he could. There will be rules in Grafton. Or did all of FTP assure Hull that they had it all taken "care of".I guess Michael the leopard is the only FTP guy who can still post all over the FSP and not get kicked off. Maybe it is because he has lots of stars next to his name? Michael the leopard wants to know why Grafton residents are so nosy about people buying property. YOU MUST BE IN TOTAL DENIAL MICHAEL. People were upset because they saw the yahoo group and all of the "players" in FTP and FSP that were involved. When I moved here I was NOT harassed probably because I didn't try to bring a migratory-internet board-voting block with me!! I also want Michael the leopard to know that just because someone doesn't like his philosphies (not facts just "big ideas") doesn't mean they are a democrat/socialist/communist. I am none of those. I oppose FTP and FSP trying to take over a town and state while lying to EVERYONE about their true intentions. You may not consider yourself a cult,but you guys follow your philosophies like they are your god and JasonPSorens is the prophet.
Michael didn't like people noticing how many FTP people are FSP people. He doesn't think we should judge FTP/FSP by the participants in the FTP group.
Michael had lots to say in defense of FSP/FTP/Hull. Here is a bit of his response to someone who doesn't love his ideas: (FSP message board)
Re:AP on 6/19 Grafton town meeting
« Reply #27 on: Today at 12:00:16pm »
"Burn Him! He wants to have neighbors who would leave him alone unlike his current situation in NJ where his neighbors routinely harass him, telling him what color to paint his house, and how to keep up his front lawn... BURN HIM, I say! That 'cult' FTP group are all surely witches and criminals and malcontents... no need for their type of trash in our community (state, or nation)...
Usually it is the libertarians sprouting conspiracy theories and such, good to see a democrat (assumption) falling prey to these misguided ideas.
: you are free to refer all or any FTP questions to me at leopardpm@yahoo.com - I am 'one of those'... it would probably save alot of grief as posting to the FSP site here really isn't productive since they do not necessarily believe in the methods of the FTP and are in no way affiliated with it... don't blame the FSP for ANY actions taken by the FTP, you are shooting the wrong target... "
Yet again no one in the FSP or FTP can believe that some people live their lives without pledging allegience to some party (Democrats,Republicans,Liberty Lovers aka Libertarians)I don't live my life based on political theory.Talk theories all you want,and then meet us back in RL aka real life.
The only reason FSP is so desperate to get rid of the FTP stuff is they are desperate to get their tax exempt status. I don't see how they will get it, unless they LIE and say they are not political. They are so technical with their jargon. Only on the papers they send to the US government is when they are technically not political.
2:02 PM
==So, you're saying that Grafton residents WANT Selectmen and Clerks who are violating state law. Are you saying that Grafton residents like to be harassed over petty things?
Come on Jay! Why do you ask such silly questions? You know people don't like to be harassed of petty things. This website is about the "take over" by the internet board voting block,remember??You are getting side tracked!
2:09 PM
"This website is about the "take over" by the internet board voting block,remember??You are getting side tracked!" :
And their conglomerate of mail-order brides to shore up their numbers, remember?
4:06 PM
Hi! I am 'Michael the leopard' who was mentioned earlier in this thread.
I would like to respond to some of the statements made:
***Michael the leopard is an FTP guy with all of the ***answers! Why wasn't he at the meeting?
I wasn't at the meeting for multiple reasons: 2000 miles away, have a small business to nurture, not necessarily a great public speaker.
***He is all over FSP letting all of FSP and FTP know ***that Grafton residents just don't understand.
ME: I think that 'some' Grafton residents understand very well - they understand that having 200 new residents which all detest the use of government force by busybodies and would vote down any such attempts... the socialists understand very well what libertarianism means to their best methods of coercion...
I would suppose that the rest of Grafton is erroring on the side of 'caution' because this whole situation has been presented to them like 'Mars Attacks' - I would probably react the same exact way if all I heard was the rantings of the few 'crazed' about a potential 'take over'... question: when you have a local election and the 'winning' side (by perhaps 51% or better) gets to institute their new regulation or ordinance or law over the remaining 49%... do you term that as a 'take over'? its the same exact thing EXCEPT that the lib 51% would be repealling laws/regulations/etc thereby INCREASING everyones freedoms and property rights...
***He says that Hull is harassed in NJ about the colors ***he is or is not allowed to paint his house. That is ***common in NJ. I know people in NJ that have to put ***up with those rules and more. They don't mind ***because they like their friends and town and they ***accept the rules.Hull should have moved out of NJ as ***soon as he could.
ME: Hull is currently trying to do just that, and his choice seems to be Grafton... and your problem is????
***There will be rules in Grafton. Or did all of FTP ***assure Hull that they had it all taken "care of".
ME: I am sure Mr. Hull will abide by all the current adnnd future rules of Grafton. His choice of Grafton is that there just might be a chance that other libs would also move there and help keep the 'zoning-busybodies' from instituting and infringing upon his property rights.
***I guess Michael the leopard is the only FTP guy who ***can still post all over the FSP and not get kicked ***off.
ME: I haven't done anything against the FSP and am not the 'rabble-rouser' that Zack is. As I understand it, the act of 'posting all over the FSP' forum is not a 'kick off-able' offense. I did come across some posts where FSPers were calling for all FTPers to be banned from the FSP, and I immediately posted that there is no need to do so... if indeed they desire to remove our names from the FSP membership roles than I would immediately quit as the organization that I signed my statement of intent with would not be calling or doing such. Thats a matter of principle... something libs tend to take very seriously as your word is all you really have in life.
***Maybe it is because he has lots of stars next to his ***name?
ME:All those pretty stars just indicate that I have made alot of posts (most probably out of ignorance). This was done about 1 year ago when I was rediscovering my libertarianism and had many questions. I believe that I hold the #5 spot for most posts, not a record I am proud of as it indicates WAY too much time spent online! It was during this time that I ran across Zack and had many debates and discussions with him, finally deciding that he would be someone I would like to meet in 'real life' - he is extreme, but he does speak honestly and truthfully. If I ever discovered that this was not the case then I would distance myself from him.
***Michael the leopard wants to know why Grafton ***residents are so nosy about people buying property. ***YOU MUST BE IN TOTAL DENIAL MICHAEL.
ME: no, not denial, more aghast at the sheer audacity that people feel they can extend ownership rights over other peoples property - I did not realize how deeply socialism has crept into even the heart of our 'free-est' state... sweet New Hampshire.
***People were upset because they saw the yahoo group and all of the "players" in FTP and FSP that were involved. When I moved here I was NOT harassed probably because I didn't try to bring a migratory-internet board-voting block with me!!
ME: so what? So I want to live in the same area as a bunch of my friends... is this a crime of some sort? One problem here is that you have never been confronted with the frustrated libertarian mindset... we libs have been totally ineffective and marginalized politically throughout our entire lives... we feel EXACTLY as you do when our neighbors vote to increase OUR taxes, to increase regulations, and the overall effect is to decrease everyones standard of living (sorry, that opens up a whole different tangent of economics, something I enjoy completely and which dovetails quite nicely with libertarianism.
****I also want Michael the leopard to know that just because someone doesn't like his philosphies (not facts just "big ideas") doesn't mean they are a democrat/socialist/communist.
ME: I couldn't care less if you agree with me on matters of philosophy BUT when you vote to strip away my hard-earned money, prevent me from hiring eager employees, or prevent me from doing with my personnal property as I see fit then, yes, you are exhibiting socialistic tendencys. True, I do not know your political persuassion, but I do know that socilists hide in the garb of both parties (Dems and Reps), their particular brand of socialism is just different.
I am none of those. I oppose FTP and FSP trying to take over a town and state while lying to EVERYONE about their true intentions.
ME: I have never concealed my intentions, I also am under NO obligation to share with ANYONE where I might choose to live and for whatever reasons I might be moving. Keep using your mantra of 'taking over a town' to try and whip up support... I think those who do a little research and ask honest question will see that no such thing is possible... you phrase it as a use of force, voting is not that.
***You may not consider yourself a cult,but you guys follow your philosophies like they are your god and JasonPSorens is the prophet.
Yes, yes... go ahead and label me with whatever evil terms you can find, truth is, being a libertarian is no different from being a part of other political leanings EXCEPT that libertarianism is the only one which actually has philosophical and ethical principles at its core: we do not believe in the initiation of the use of force as an ethical means of obtaining goals, we also do not believe in using fraud, deceit, or theft . We also strongly believe that the sole purpose of government is to protect citizens from these infringements of basic rights.
No, Jason is no God... he happens to be a smarter than average 'kid' who came up with an idea that rekindled the fires of freedom within libertarians and others (constitutionalist, anarchists, greens, democrats, republicans, etc) that have been smoldering for 30 years.
***Michael didn't like people noticing how many FTP people are FSP people.
ME: what? I don't understand this statement - I clearly understand that ALL FTP people are or were FSP members - so what? We all own cars too, and probably all have a blue shirt in our closet... this is a crime?
***He doesn't think we should judge FTP/FSP by the participants in the FTP group.
True. The members of the FTP group are acting under no leadership from the FSP Inc. All ideas and motivations and 'plans' are their own. Tim Condon was/is a 'member' of the FTP group AND also happens to be the FSP membership Coordinator - but that has no influence over us, he is not our 'leader' nor is 'zack' - we respect action... I, myself, consider Mr. Hulls purchase of property to be the closest thing to 'leadership' this group has managed to put forth... we mostly debate and bicker amongst ourselves, we are our own worst enemies! (LOL, it makes me laugh to think that some entire town somewhere is supposedly 'terrified' of our fruitless efforts to-date).
***Yet again no one in the FSP or FTP can believe that some people live their lives without pledging allegience to some party (Democrats,Republicans,Liberty Lovers aka Libertarians).
ME: Where does this come from? I myself lived for most of my life just plodding along and dealing with things directly in front of me, let alone having time to 'indulge' in the abstractness of politics... it was only when other people began to use politics against me to restrict me freedoms that I became aware at how potent and dangerous it is to let the monster of government be controlled solely by controll freaks... I say live your life as you see fit, but would caution you to rethink your ideas if you think you will not be affected by 'those on high'... it can't be helped.
***I don't live my life based on political theory.Talk theories all you want,and then meet us back in RL aka real life.
I don't either, I am currently trying my best to live my life by very strict principles and with a healthy dose of compassion thrown in - politics is just something that happens to prevent me from doing so...
***The only reason FSP is so desperate to get rid of the FTP stuff is they are desperate to get their tax exempt status. I don't see how they will get it, unless they LIE and say they are not political. They are so technical with their jargon. Only on the papers they send to the US government is when they are technically not political.
ME: You have no idea what motivations may exist within the FSP, make all the gueses and innuendos you want but I refuse to believe that you have the uncanny ability to divine the desires of the FSP Board, let alone the 6,000 other members... now its your turn to come back to reality...
lover of cats, liberty, and cookies (not necessarily in that order)
Michael
AKA: LeopardPM
email: leopardpm@yahoo.com
thanks for your time
6:04 AM
Michael- Thank you for responding. I am not convinced by your statements. I agree with almost all of what you wrote. The problem is that whole FTP. Don't you see how a small town of many differnt backgrounds won't like a group coming to "take over" the local government and put in their people/their "dream sherrif" and get rid of almost all of what EVERYONE here has been used to? I understand you don't like not being allowed to live you life freely. I have never had that problem. I guess I don't want to do what you and FTP want to do? I am not trying to RUIN your life or CONTROL you. But that is what I see FTP is triying to do to Grafton. I don't care if you live with a group of liberty loving friends. But when you RECRUIT anyone who will go to Grafton full or part time just to vote is wrong and sneaky and not neighborly. I have 4 small kids and I don't want them to be raised in "donkeysexville" and I am not OK with people coming to Grafton to institue "shocktown". All of these terms are from your yahoo planning sessions. If you are so innocent,then you may be in the wrong group!Anyway,I am done with this,because you have the same song and dance as Condon. I know you have been involved in all of this so I don't see how you don't know about the "take over".
7:46 AM
Michaels Response:
****Michael- Thank you for responding. I am not convinced by your statements.
ME: Thank you also! I find this latest post of yours most heartening in that we both seem to be a bit calmed down and talking civilly and rationally.
****I agree with almost all of what you wrote.
ME: (mouth drops to the floor) How much do I owe ya? Never had THAT effect on others! But, I do truly believe that folks of all types and creeds ultimately have the same goals and desires - it is only in the methods wwhere we tend to differ.
****The problem is that whole FTP. Don't you see how a small town of many differnt backgrounds won't like a group coming to "take over" the local government and put in their people/their "dream sherrif" and get rid of almost all of what EVERYONE here has been used to?
Actually, I do understand your position. And it is the same position that lots of folks have when faced with the unknown or just change in general - fear. AND I understand how the verbage and dialogue of the FTP discussions would foster this fear and promote perhaps even greater fear. I personally think that some mistakes were made in our little 'informal' discussion group - there were those of us who decided that they were writing to a different audience (potential lib movers) and were quite exact in their posts of what 'freedom' means and all of its implications. This was done in an effort to attract 'purists', those that had taken libertarianism not only to their heart, but throughout their core being. Perhaps those conversations and 'purity tests' should have been left to other discussion forums.
****I understand you don't like not being allowed to live you life freely. I have never had that problem.
ME: actually, you have and just do not realize it... are you suggesting that you personally approve of how the government (local, state, or federal) spends every dollar that they compel you to pay? but, this is an entire different thred and I would rather not get sidetracked here...
****But when you RECRUIT anyone who will go to Grafton full or part time just to vote is wrong and sneaky and not neighborly.
ME: hmmmm, I don't understand - are you saying that if I move to Grafton that I would do nothing else but vote, and that would be the end of my actions? I would work, build, employ, go to church social events (if allowed, I guess), sponsor local children in their endeavors, help my neighbor (lib or not) build his barn/storage shed/new deck/etc. What is somehow getting lost in all this is that this group called the 'ftp' is somehow inhuman and so radically different from the ordinary folks currently living in Grafton. The concentration of voting power is only ONE aspect of what I am moving for, and what others are moving for - it is NOT our lives as that life would be very empty indeed.
****I have 4 small kids and I don't want them to be raised in "donkeysexville" and I am not OK with people coming to Grafton to institue "shocktown".
LOL! Yes, the 'donkeysexville' thing is quite a graphic depiction, utterly tasteless and perhaps rude. I don't think ANYONE would want to visit such a place so I do not worry about it much - the market has a wonderful way of squashing socially unacceptable practices and displays. I would not use the force of government to try to prevent this thing though (whatever it really is, I can only guess). I am also sure that you would care for your children and would take steps in censoring whatever it was that you did not approve of. For instance, if I opened up some porny/smut shop (trust me, I will NOT do this, I am a printer not a smutter - this is for example only) and a parent came to me and said that they do not approve of their children (under 18) visiting my property then I would take steps to make sure your wishes were heeded. Places such as these tend to distance themselves naturally away from those who would disagree (ie: a smut shop would not naturally open up across or next to a church).
****All of these terms are from your yahoo planning sessions. If you are so innocent,then you may be in the wrong group!
ME: I do not know how 'innocent' I am except that I do not plan on breaking any laws and am thus 'innocent' of crimes. I totally believe that power needs to be wrested back from government and given to the citizens and I think that this group, although not necessarily the best cadre of folks to publically represent the 'movement', have the same desire and conviction as I do - and they are willing to take drastic (moving) steps to effect possible change. I am not in the 'wrong' group and I will allow myself to be painted by wide-sweeping brush strokes with them... its a small sacrifice for liberty.
****Anyway,I am done with this,because you have the same song and dance as Condon.
My singing is only slightly less atrocious than my dancing - I am sure Tim outclasses me in both. I am no lawyer (in fact, I would promote the disolvement of the state bar/guild that raises the cost of law services and prevents very capable others from providing assistance to those in need - thus, I would seek to discredit Tims 'high and mighty' status as 'lawyer'). Please don't mistake my calm manner as some sort of 'song & dance' or 'wool pulling over eyes', I do not shirk from any questions you might have and do so in an atmosphere of trying to educate rather than 'divide'.
****I know you have been involved in all of this so I don't see how you don't know about the "take over".
Yes, I am involved. It is the 'take over' in the way you portray it that I do not agree with. Lets take the current population of Grafton, what about 1200, right? Of these, how many are democrats and how many republicans? Let me assume that the split is something like 70% Rep and 30% Dem. Do you consider the Reps 'taking over' the government there? How would you feel if the Dems got sick of seeing their ideas get pushed aside totally and they were always being forced by the 'majority' to pay for things enacted by the Reps which they totally did not agree with? And so the Dems move, perhaps to a neighboring town which is currently 50/50 split and thus tilting the status quo in their favor... did they 'take over'? I don't think so - they moved and voted with their hearts and principles, as we all should do... the whole 'take over' message from the yahoo group and even from Jason in his earlier days is probably too combative of a term and really does not effectively convey the actual events desired to occur.
sorry that you have given up on discussing this subject with me - You and your family REALLY have nothing to fear from my moving near you or into Grafton, I am not coming to 'save you from yourselves', but rather to build up a wall of liberty to protect myself from those who would destroy it... it just happens that you would have th option of 'testing the waters' if you desired... a new and different choice which most folks in the US do not ever get.
michael
10:16 AM
Michael, why don't you tell us how you feel about Murphy, Phillips and Maynard.
Who are the "little Hitlers" in Grafton you don't like Michael?
"the Free Town Project aims to move FSP members to one small population NH town to serve as a test bed of libertarian ideas..."
Do you agree with that quote?
11:04 AM
Hello, once again... this is kinda fun... much better than us libs debating amongst ourselves... we do end up becoming quite obscure and abstract - if nothing else you are helping remind me of the actual 'faces' behind that mysterious town named 'Grafton'.... here goes...
***Anonymous said...
Michael, why don't you tell us how you feel about Murphy, Phillips and Maynard.
ME: I know that Amanda is an anarchist and is currently the 'president' or somesuch of the FSP. I did see a TV piece on her which I downloaded, shes kinda cute, kinda scarey (at least as far as I could tell...), but I loved her license plate and they way she carried herself. Murphy and Maynard I haven't had much interaction with online (not that I recall, and if I did it was evidently un-memorable)
***Who are the "little Hitlers" in Grafton you don't like Michael?
ME: The little 'hitlers' I think you are referring to wold be those folks who would institute zoning controls over othre peoples property - I know of no one specifically and I think that this actual term was brought up in a conversation describing Homeowner Association types that love to tell others how to live... I do not remember this term being used describing a person in particular in Grafton.
One thing that may be related to this is Zack tried for several months to get public records from the town clerk and was either refused or something (ask him, he tells it better). After being thus frustrated, he mistakenly put the name of a particular Graftonite whom he thought was causing this trouble up on a list he keeps of folks who actually take action (illegal in some cases) against libs, or perhaps are just outspoken. The purpose of this list is for reference so that other libs could perhaps decide not to associate with same people (their business or whatever). UNFORTUNATELY, Zack made a BIG mistake and put up the name of a totally innocent person. He was contacted by this person and the mistake explained to him after which he removed the innocent name from the list and immediately made a public apology. It is my belief that this incident is what initially started all of this hub-bub...
****"the Free Town Project aims to move FSP members to one small population NH town to serve as a test bed of libertarian ideas..."
Do you agree with that quote?
ME: yes. I would preface it with a couple of items though: (1) 'test bed' has a potentiality of being a 'negative' - for instance if some government regulation were removed and actual harm came from this action, then it would be stupid not to reinstitute the regulation - we are not trying to 'play' with anyones lives as such and desire alot of the same things that others wish: safety for our children, jobs, cheap and easy access to utilities, etc...
(2) the 'ideas' are not necessarily just some abstract concoctions generated out of debate clubs... there are alot of real world examples to draw from and expand upon: volunteer fire departments, private roads, private schooling, etc...
*****rebecca said...
Michael- I am through with discussing it with you because I still oppose the FTP/FSP group mentality of moving in a voting block. I hear what you are saying. It all sounds good. Based on what you wrote above, I know Grafton would have welcomed you and your ideas. But now I am not so sure because of your associations with FTP/FSP.
ME: Rebecca, I realize that wherever I (or we) end up moving to there will be a definite period of time during which I (or we) will be under scrutiny be my (our) neighbors. This is fine as I have no doubt that 'most' libs/FTPers are relatively harmless and can 'prove' themselves at least as normal humans.
****When I first moved to Grafton I knew there were some Libertarians,and I thought having a group from a 3rd party would be positive. I don't like only having 2 choices. But now I want to leave it with the 2 parties now, if Big L Militant Libs. may come here and implement their ideas, some which are against my morals and negative for ANY town (except donkeysexville which doesn't exist yet as far as I know!)
That is just fine, as long as you allow me the same sentiment except in reverse if and when I move. I would rather have less Dems/Reps and more Libs. Whats with the 'militant' thing? We are no 'waco' group or extremist 'shoot 'em up crazies'! Definitely bad form when children are involved and we are talking FAMILIES moving here.
****Mike Lorrey said today that the move to Grafton is economic. But Amanda Philips said that the FTP IS political. Anyway,thanks for answering and I do hope what you say is sincere because then you will do just fine in NH.
Both Mike and Amanda speak for themselves only, not for me, and I would assume not for others. If you ask me personally what my reasons are/would be... partially political, partial economic, partial social - I do not relish the prospect of your winters, but I am in love with the general NH atmosphere and foliage... it does have a serene, dreamlike quality that can be mezmerizing... you are VERY lucky to already live and rear your children in such an environment!
hope his helps! michael
1:15 PM
As long as you continue to tell the truth, you should be fine in Grafton.
If you follow Mike Lorrey, Amanda Phillips and Tim Condon's example of lying...lots of luck to you.
Bob Hull didn't seem to lie at the meeting. He keep pretty quiet. This shyness is a little unsettling, as he has bought so much land. I'm just not sure how to feel about Bob. He didn't post much on the yahoo group, and when he did, he did not say anything inflammatory.
1:49 PM
>Both Mike and Amanda speak for themselves only, not for me, and I would assume not for others.
Well, they claim to be speaking for two groups that you belong to FSP and FTP. Amanda is the National Spokesperson for the FSP. Maybe you should not be in a group if you do not want the leaders/Spokes people of the group to speak for you.
That is why I will not join any political party. If you do not want anyone to speak for you, become Independent. My 'I' is bigger than your 'i'.
1:54 PM
Bob is quite mysterious to us also - he is always polite, very reserved and quiet. He seems to be desparate in his search for refugee from those who would otherwise oppress him in some manner. Although he has purchased alot of land, I wouldn't put it past him to plop a house down in the middle of his expanse and use the rest as a 'buffer' from both other libs and other folks! We shall see his plans as they unfold, its all pretty exciting to most of us, ad boring to others...
michael
2:08 PM
Bob Hull's expanses aren't all connected. I'm not quite sure where the middle would be.
6:51 PM
Amanda is a lying stinking cunt.I was briefly asociated w/ the fsp before the vote.go into their archives to the true Amanda.
John Dour
8:23 PM
Oh,I forgot to add that Zack aint a bad guy.He talks alot of shit but he's a stand up guy.Beware of the fsp leadership
8:28 PM
I really can't keep up with all the different parts of this Blog - join this Yahoo Group and we can talk, and Zack (I am sure will be there as well - Zack also has a forum to post questions to which is good also, up to you.... if you want to grill us on anything from 'What the Heck are you doing?' to 'Libertarianism is Stupid!', we will be happy to oblige... there.
I created a Yahoo Group expressly for the purpose of discussing items with Grafonites, if anyone cares to participate or lurk, it could be very enlightening... I do not know if anyone from Grafton will join up...
Group name: GraftonCrisis
Group home page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GraftonCrisis
Group email: GraftonCrisis@yahoogroups.com
Zacks Forum:
http://forum.freecountyproject.com/index.php?board=8
thank you for your time...
michael
8:44 PM
Hey Grafton shitbags. THE PLAN IS TO TAKE YOU OVER BY FORCE! Don't get confused. I'm an FSP member and we talk about it all the time. We also formulate stories to spoon-feed this blog and twist your little hillbilly minds into our way of thinking. Haha, you are puppets.
You haven't had an original complaint or issue, that has not been planted by an FSP representative since the first week of inception. The funny thing is, I can tell you this now, and still be in control of you by the end of the day. The lights are a little dim in Grafton, and they will soon go out!
There is no plan to move to Grafton. Do you understand that shitbags?? Understand, when I say "shitbags" I'm talking about everyone in NH, not just Grafton. The plan is to TAKE OVER, migration is not necessary, who the fuck would live in Grafton on purpose anyway? BTW, NH wasn't chosen because it is the most " free state" it was chosen because the people who occupy it are generally the most ignorant residents that occupy any state and they are as defenseless as school girls when it comes to politics. You are completly predictable with every action you take. This blog is all you can do to defend yourselves against the impending take over?? That is why Grafton was chosen. Do you think the same response would be offered out west??? Not a chance, they would have skinned us alive for throwing Zack at them, but you people are great, you take it right in the ass and ask for more. Zack was great wasn't he?? I don't think anyone could have done it better. You responded with the usual predictability, just like what was planned. Haha, boy, it was beautiful!
Grafton will be TAKEN OVER! don't you worry about that. The snare has already been tripped by your very own top official. It's all over but the publicity for the next endeavor. This will go down in history as one of the most profound political coups in America's history, and ya'll git to be a part of it, so, look alive! Everyone is watching.
8:20 PM
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